Tavares, FL First published March 22, 2018 Last update: Apr. 9, 2022
by Vance Jochim, Florida resident and watchdog blogger at FiscalRangers.com and retired internal audit manager and anti-corruption consultant.
This blog is the personal opinion of Vance Jochim of FiscalRangers.com.
Added Apr. 9, 2022 - Florida Solar Roof Warning: The Florida House & Senate have passed a bill, "Net Metering" - HB 741 (2022) that reduces subsidies for solar panel & roof systems. At this date, the bill will go to the Governor for signing, but solar industry lobbyists are trying to get him to veto the bill. Read the bill summary and status. This bill could REDUCE payback to you for solar you "sell" to power firms, and also let them charge solar roof owners a fixed fee (we assume to offset their existing infrastructure maintenance cost). https://www.flsenate.gov/Session/Bill/2022/741 Better yet, read this official Florida Senate "Bill Summary" which clearly lays out the phaseout of many government and power industry subsidies for solar power systems. THUS WE ARE WARNING YOU: Promised solar system benefits due to Florida government subsidy rules are being phased out. Do not believe any sales pitch for solar that promises reduced power company rates, selling your excess energy to them, or Florida solar subsidies. READ the bill, IF passed and signed by Gov. DeSantis soon. If you already have a solar roof, you should read the bill, when signed, to see if and when subsidies you get or new fees will be implemented.
HERE is an industry article that says this bill will "gut the solar industry".
- "The bill directs the Public Service Commission (PSC) to change net metering requirements and have customers pay the full cost of electric service instead of that being "subsidized" by non-net metering customers, which utilities have argued would amount to hundreds of millions of dollars. Distributed energy sold to the grid would also be credited below retail rates and net metering customers could be billed fixed charges and other fees that would drive up the cost of distributed solar."
Added Apr. 9, 2022 - Publicity over new "nighttime" solar panels developed at Stanford Univ. is all hype and they barely generate any power. WATCH this marketing hype exposed by this video. He points out all the raving articles that avoid disclosing they only generate a minimal .04% of their daylight solar power capacity until the end of the article. Barely enough to charge a cell phone. Solar panels continue to be hyped and many marketing pitches lead to financial losses, in our opinion. Apr. 9, 2022.
Update Mar. 9, 2021: Channel 9 (Orlando, FL) Investigation (Jan. 21, 2021) into a Florida family who lost promised energy savings of $100,000 by a solar panel firm. Promised savings from Florida State rebates, and reduction in rates were only 50% of the promised savings from the vendor Empire Solar Group, and did not cover payments as promised by the solar panel vendor. "One of the most common complaints homeowners have about solar systems is the lack of savings. Leaving customers with big loan payments and monthly power bills. Complaints to the Federal Trade Commission more than tripled since 2012 and many consumers said they were left with higher utility costs."
Updated Dec. 23, 2018 with more info including a YouTube review of a solar panel installation, and risky PACE financing programs for solar roofs.
Updated Dec. 23, 2018 - A well known YouTuber on personal computers, Paul's Hardware, installed a Tesla solar panel roof in California, and published his 6-month review of the entire process and his experience. He paid $32,000 CASH for it and got a $9k rebate. He was "told" to expect a 11 year payback and was happy with it, while providing an affinity marketing link to Tesla Solar (which earns him a commission). Over 300,000 of his almost 1-million subscribers have viewed the video and posted over 1500 comments. READ the comments of his tech savvy subscribers where many doubt the sanity of the deal and even post some new issues I have not covered below. One caveat is that Tesla requires their Powerwall to be connected to the internet, otherwise it turns the battery system off. Some commenters said that if they have a power outage, they can't use the Powerwall due to that requirement. So, watch the video, read the info below, and decide if you want to risk your funds. And remember, he got a free roof replacement, which I doubt most consumers without high viewership vlogs would get. https://youtu.be/6s6kN9Ezws0. Finally, if you are considering a solar panel roof, search Google on "Solar Panel lawsuits" and read what you find. In the first 10 hits, was an article where Solar City (now known as Tesla Solar) in California agreed to a $400-million fine from a class action lawsuit due to mis-representing solar in sales presentations.
The short address to this FiscalRangers.com factsheet is: http://www.fiscalrangers.com/Solar-Panel-Scams.html
Solar Panel systems for residences in the US seem to generate some scams, lies and mis-representation.
Sure, there actually could be legitimate providers, perhaps a local only firm. If you review all the areas of risk below, and find they are protected against by various means, you might be ok. But don't just make an emotional, uninformed decision without reading this article AND the contract. Don't rely on ANY verbal sales promises.
FIRST, if you don't like to READ articles like this, but only ask people, you probably have a higher chance of being scammed. Compare the time to read this vs what you could lose if you get taken by a "no money down, save 30% on electrical bills" $20,000 home remodeling or solar sales pitch like those described below. If you did already sign a contract, most states require a 3 day waiting period where you can cancel, so read below to see if you possibly got a good provider or not."
But as a retired Certified Fraud Examiner, when anyone starts pitching no money down, payments lower than your current electric cost, etc. I get nervous.
I mean, when I was a kid, I sold encyclopedias door to door and learned how the publisher mis-represented what the customer got.
I sold newspaper subscriptions by phone while in college until I learned the promises by the LA Times sales contracor were lies. "50% of the proceeds will go for a free Christmas dinner for orphans" (TRUE)
I went on tours to get work as a college student to sell land in California' Salton Sea area, and saw boiler rooms pressuring customers to buy based only upon mis-represented facts provided by the sellers (much harder to do these days with internet sources being available).
I worked as a salesman for aluminum patio rooms for a contractor in Southern California who sold via leads provided by Home Depot, and he WAS ethical, and provided full transparency in his contracts. But I learned about how other shifty competitors mis-led consumers.
Then I was a Certified Internal Auditor and Certified Fraud Examiner, I learned other scams and frauds.
So I am a skeptic about many sales pitches in the home services industry.
And it seems the solar panel industry is rife with scams and mis-leading marketing, including a fast growing financing scheme called "PACE".
So here are some details I have collected to help you identify the ethical providers and also the potential scam artists. Once I see ads for a solar panel firm, I research "theirname lawsuits" on Google and and usually find many posts of purchases that went bad. And I find webpages showing customer reviews. The problem is some "review websites" take funds from companies to allow them to answer any complaint, and you wonder if bad complaints are just removed upon request of the company.
READ this linked article I wrote in 2015 and later updated it in 2017, including details on the huge scams in California and Arizona by firms like Solar City, which was later purchased by Elon Musk of Tesla Motors, and now has offices in Florida with a new name Tesla Solar.
My latest 2018 batch of warnings about solar panels:
Today, March 22, 2018, when logging in to my Google GMAIL account, Comcast in Lake County, FL displayed an ad for their "team member" SunRun.com and solar panels with encouragement to call for a quote on a solar panel roof with $0 down and payments of only 70% of my current electrical bill. Apparently this firm, SunRun, also sells through retail establishments also, like Costco. As a customer of a firm like Comcast or Costco, you have a target on your back to sell you higher profit programs like home installation projects. I learned that when I worked for the Home Depot patio room contractor in California. They jump up and down, and will let the sales firms sign you up any way they can because the store earns a much bigger commission than selling a lawnmower or wrench.
I did some research, and reported this on my Facebook profile and FiscalRangers YouTube account:
"Comcast users! Comcast is now posting ads on the GMAIL login page for Solar panels from "team member" Sunrun. As always, I warn people about the potential for solar scams. I looked up "Sunrun lawsuits" and found this "Consumer Affairs" website which is something like Better Business Bureau. They have good reviews from newer customers, but if you search on the two star reviews and sort older first, you find many problems. If you are buying into the "zero down" and 30% less electric bill claims, just read these reviews and also lookup my factsheet.
READ the complaints above, sorted by older first. I say older first because contract to buy or lease are usually about 20 years, and people are happy the first 1-3 years, then problems come up and they are angry at being stuck with 15-17 years of payments when the promises are no longer met. Of course, many are because customers are unsophisticaed and listen only to verbal promises that are not in writing.
This is what you get if you search on "SunRun Lawsuits" - read them.
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Here are my favorite complaints about various US solar panel installations from different sources:
- Promised savings disappear because too many panels were installed and the electric firm stopped paying as much for excess electricity.
- A well regarded retailer like Costco or Comcast may be a marketing "partner" but their name and product liability is not in the contract which is from a different firm.
- A consumer may check them out on the Better Business Bureau (BBB) and find nothing. That could be because BBB complaint databases are by STATE, not National, thus they don't have a HQ in Florida, thus BBB complaints are only filed in their homestate, and not in yours. At least also check www.homeadvisor.com and www.AngiesList.com .
- Florida only recently changed laws so solar panel roofs could be sold by third parties other than the utilities. So scams have not reached the volume they did in California and Arizona years ago. Those people are moving to Florida to sell the systems.
- Financing falls apart or rates change, ruining cost calculations.
- Some financing gets local governments to put the annual payments on your house property tax bill. Then you can't sell OR REFINANCE the house because payments are higher than other local homes.
- Financing or loans are typically sold through other firms or organizations, thus you are stuck with the payments if the product fails. "You signed the contract, didn't you?"
- Some cities or utilities are "marketing partners" with solar firms, and those firms may even use a city letterhead (which just happened in one Florida city) to mis-represent the service or product as being from the city. Don't believe it. Naive local government staff think they are helping residents, but they are really setting them up for possible future problems where the city will not accept responsibility.
- The financing is a lien on your house, and it is like having a long term pool payment - many buyers can't qualify for the higher payments, thus you have to sell the house for less, or not be able to sell it. Or, you have to pay off the entire lien to eliminate that anchor on selling the house.
- Customers are not informed of risks due to storm damage, obsolescence, critter damage, failure of underlying roofs, etc.
- The financing is a lien on the house which is considered a second mortgage. Thus you later want to get a second mortgage for some reason and find you are not eligible since you have that long term solar payment due. You would have to pay it off FIRST to get another second mortgage.
- The roof needs to be replaced, and suddenly, the solar firm wants $2000 or more to remove and replace panels after the roof is repaired.
- Leaks occur due to the fasteners and the firm takes days or weeks to send a repair guy out.
- SQUIRRELS build homes under the panels, chew through wires. The Solar Firm wants $1800 to install "squirrel guards".
- Promised rebates expire, or are used up before applications are submitted, thus the customer loses any promised rebates.
- The panels fail before end of warranty and are not honored.
- Insurance may not cover damage to panels so you may need a costly rider for added insurance protection.
- Panels get older and less efficient, and promised savings disappear so utility usage and costs increase, while the solar panel payment liability also continues. If they won't promise to always reduce the panel payment to ensure total electric costs are below a stated amount, don't believe verbal promises.
- The solar panel system could include a "power wall" for battery backup and electrical storage. Make sure that if the power is out from a Hurricane, etc. that the vendor doesn't require an internet connection to provide the stored power. If your power is out, and no internet connection, people have reported they could not use their Tesla Powerwalls during power outages. So make sure you can use battery stored energy if the power grid is off.
So consider yourself warned. Do your research. Have your OWN attorney review the contract to protect YOU, not just the vendor. Install squirrel guards! (or know the price). Don't RELY on any verbal promises, such as "if you must replace the roof, we will remove and replace the panels for just $500. GET IT IN WRITING!
How to find legitimate installers of Solar and other home products:
- Research their name and "Lawsuits" to find any issues.
- Research them on Angie's List or other firms (BBB is so so, and sells "memberships" to companies to allow them to answer complaints.)
- Research if a local, well regarded firm is selling the product and get competitive bids. I would trust a local firm in business more than 10 years over a national sales firm.
- Determine if you are relying on some "brand" who referred you, like Comcast, and whether Comcast is in the agreement or they just get a commission for referral fees.
- Investigate any financing source as a separate risk from the product. The product could be fine, but the installer and financing source also must be ethical and customer focused. It doesn't help if you have the best quality solar panels, but they are installed improperly so the roof leaks or the financing has buried terms that are risky.
- Research the actual products for quality. Some solar panels from China could fail earlier than any warranty period.
- Determine if they gloss over, or only make verbal promises regading some of the risks I listed above.
Vance Jochim
FiscalRangers.com - Tavares, FL
Copyright Vance Jochim and FiscalRangers.com on March 22, 2018.
Content from this article may be used within context as long as credit is given to FiscalRangers.com and Vance Jochim and a link is provided to this article.
